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/hikki/ - NEET / Advice

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Recently i lost all my friends including internet ones too. So i've been feeling pretty frustrated. Usually i loved spending time on my own and denied people in meetings just because i changed my mind. But since my internet friend got a gf (we were tight about 3 years) , i argued with my the only one irl friend and worldwide known pandemic got to my hometown i (surprisingly) have nobody to share my feelings with. How to enjoy your own company without knowing that you always have a"pillow of safety" in the form of friends?


I don't understand why you need IRL friends when you have the internet…


Understanding your relationship with your friends is about as fun as sliding you're cock into a zebra


I dunno man. I'm in a similar situation. Conversations online aren't visceral enough for me. My own company is the same old. I have seen that the best things in my life ultimately happen from being in the presence of others.

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post itt if you are sickly as well as NEET

i got CFS/ME/SEID/whatever docs wanna call it, but basically im too tired to leave the house or even bed most of the time, and its not depression or anything mental

also get mad headaches, nausea, and dizziness from just standing up

also relevant is itt NO BULLYING ALLOWED!!
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I have intestinal issues, whenever I eat I have to lie down because of the pain. Great thing to have in addition to depression.


I'm starting to have issues with high iron, high cholesterol, high sugar, chest pains, breathing problems, fatigue, and insomnia. It doesn't help that I have plenty of mental problems. I've tried to go to a therapist before but I always freak out and can't handle it. I wouldn't go out of the house even to a doctor's appointment until recently which is literally the only place I go when I leave the house. It's been this way for about two years now. I've been trying to eat better in terms of my diet. I cut soda, have been eating more fruits as well as vegetables, and decreased eating red meat. I've been having a problem drinking more coffee now though in place of not drinking soda though. But I've had insomnia problems LONG before I even touched a cup of coffee. Ironically sometimes after drinking a cup of coffee and having a long piss session afterwards it'll put me right to sleep. Funny how coffee puts me to sleep sometimes and melatonin keeps me up for days.


I relapsed health wise and my dad is here minding me but I'm still doing pretty well

The 1 bedroom flat is fucking terrible but it'll do until a few months when I get a new place

Making lots of music now



Have a new place now holed up for Corona
Also a gf which is nice although she's very energy sapping makes it hard to pace myself


Recovering from some sort of foot infection thing.
Been on anti-biotics for like 9 days.

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Have any of you ever experienced ego death? It was such a terrifying but also very eye opening experience for me. I ended up going outside for the first time in a couple of years the day afterwards. Couldn't even get my own groceries, couldn't even get near the front door… I know it's not all simply solved now, I'm still going to have some issues, but for the first time in my life I finally feel grateful to be alive, and it's such an amazing feeling. I think I'm finally on the path to escaping this hellscape of agoraphobia.
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Here's someone who's never experienced ego death.



here's another lol


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and another one

Ego death can be euphoric, but it's not the same as euphoria. It's the complete loss of the sense of self caused by total suppression of short-term and long-term memory access. During ego death you observe the world around you without any concept of your past or identity. It's a very bizarre feeling. The euphoria comes from the total abandonment of your usual mental and emotional burdens during the experience, and it can be very inspiring in retrospect.


Maybe your soul expired…


you can do that kind of thing through practicing meditation , no need for drugs

In OP's story he's clearly just chasing the purple dragon

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officially back to neetdom after being fired recently, it was only a few months of shitty work. first job i've had in this new state in 3 years and dropped out of college 1 year ago.

wondering if my options above are really all i have left.

i found working on below-subpar wages for months on end, dealing with manic depression and mental instability from my mom's failing health and my father's abuse, dissociation-episodes from body dysmorphia, and stress/anger issues with customers isn't the life i want to keep dealing with.

my folks are adamant on kicking me out if i dont find a job again, but being a useless queer fuckwit with no skills and no goals besides reading manga and playing vidya online with peeps, aka being the lazy asshole im only ever gonna be, makes it hard to wanna find reasons to go back into wagecucking.

do i skip steps and just rope or try and just fail to get buxs from SSI or some shit?
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>>"lgbt tranny here can I get donations! UmU here's my discord 0w0"(USER WAS WARNED FOR THIS POST)


u aint wrong anon, u aint wrong


I'm very sorry that you're in that situation, OP.

Personally I would never go for the rope unless I thought that without doing so I might end up in a situation where I wouldn't even have the option - for example, I might consciously consider the rope IF I was facing some sort of awful disease that might render me unable to make the decision and execute it at some point. I don't think there's any shame in choosing to exit, and I don't think you have anything to worry about as I believe in a resurrection of the dead, so you'll just wake up afterwards, but it's a really horrible decision to even consider, and so long as you're alive I guess there is always at least some hope that things will improve, and at least some hope to find some sort of happiness or meaning.

I think, so long as you're not suggesting damaging yourself first in order to be able to get it, that you should at least try for the SSI, though you'd have to consider the possible consequences of doing so for yourself (sorry I don't know much about the US system). I know from my own experience on NEETbux that it can be very hard to escape that situation once you've been in in long enough, and my situation has been very bad at points - but then again, I'm not sure the alternative was any better, if I'd continued working I'm sure that right now I'd just have wasted vastly more time serving other people, rather than at least having some time to myself as a NEET (even if in the end, my family stole vast amounts of it during that that time).

I don't think there's any shame in doing the sugardaddy thing so long as you don't actually have sex. If you can find someone willing to pay you to see photos or videos or something, it may not be ideal - but considering the amount of humiliation and subjugation involved in 'normal' wageslavery, I'm not sure that it's any worse. I don't see it as exploitation in either direction, but it's absolutely disgusting that people might have to reduce themselves to that rather than get support from 'society'. People in general should be ashamed for allowing such a situation to exist.

Maybe if you find a way to subsist for now, you'll eventually at least inherit your parents house if they own it? I see it as your parents having a moral obligation to support you, no matter how old, considering they brought you into the world and are responsible for your upbringing, so it's pretty terrible of them to want to toss you out. Is there Post too long. Click here to view the full text.


updating, still alive but not well.

however this virus turned out to be a blessing in disguise for me in a variety of ways

1. my folks actually care about me and wont kick me out in the middle of a pandemic
2. everyone around me now is living my lifestyle so im understood a bit better by some
3. im not able to get a job during all of this

but, shit still aint great or even good in the slightest.

unemployment benefits in my state is taking forever to come through, i havent gotten a stimulus check either, and im still waiting to hear back about disability / SSI shit so while i am "safe" to stay and be more of myself, im still not in any better of a financial situation.

its stressing me out and while i dont feel as bad as i did at the start of this, it's still hurting and terrible in my eyes and if anything i am believing the second this pandemic ends, i might just have to give it all up and just do it already.

for as much as i talk about this 'an hero', ill be honest and say i still fear it and still am pushed to keep going by some natural instinct to stay alive. say what u will about being over-dramatic and being being a fucking special snowflake pussy, but thats just the point, i am that shit and right now im still considering adding myself to the suicide rate of people like me.
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Lots of people get SSI $700 a month
Some people get SSDI $1,000 month
If a parent is dead you could get Survivor Benefits $1,400

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>A Hikikomori on the other hand (abbreviated hikki) is someone who seals themselves inside their home and does not leave at all for any reason, generally for 6 months or more in the clinical definition. Some NEETs are hikikomoris, but not all hikikomoris are NEETs – for example, a hikikomori could work or take classes from home. Sometimes "Hikikomori" is used less formally to describe a person who very rarely leaves their home due to social anxieties, and this can go hand in hand with the isolation often brought about by the NEET lifestyle.

This is incorrect i think we need to clear up this misconception all hikikomori are NEETs having a job or receiving an education means you are still apart of society. The Japanese government describes hikikomori 引きこもり as those who do not work do not go to school and isolate themselves in their parents house in their rooms for 6 months due to mainly social and cultural triggers related to Japanese society and while NEETs are global hikikomori is mostly only a Japanese problem and there are only a few true cases overseas in the west due to the cultural differences between the east and the west. Also the verb 引く has only one k, and 引く is the Japanese word for pull and hikikomori means to pull inward or (Acute Social Withdrawal)

Video by a gaijin living in Japan who has researched hikikomori.


If you have a difference of opinion that is okay this thread is meant to be a civil debate thread so admin please do not lock this thread.


>admin please do not lock this thread
damn, look at this guy knowing the admins intended culture


Institutions already alienate us, why should we care for their rigid definitions? I think there is a difference between NEET and Hiki but the Hikis themselves should define this. Considering the complexity and variation of humans at large I'd imagine there are gradients of hikikomori. I don't know where that line is between hiki and NEET but a ridged adherence to strict definitions only creates walled gardens, at least with things like this. Discussing what a hiki is isn't the same as something more concrete like physics.


>I think there is a difference between NEET and Hiki

The only difference is one can be social while not contributing to society the other is isolated completely or nearly completely here is some more interesting info i found on some Japanese websites regarding hikikomori.

From Japanese Wikipedia.

引きこもり(引き籠もり[1]、ひきこもり、英語表記 hikikomori[2])とは、仕事や学校に行けず家に籠り、家族以外とほとんど交流がない人の状況を指す。現時点では、日本の厚生労働省はこうした状態が6か月以上続いた場合を定義としている

Acute Social Withdrawal (Withdrawal [1], Withdrawal English notation Hikikomori [2]) refers to the situation where people cannot go to work or school, stay at home, and have little interaction with their family. At present, the Japanese Ministry of Health, Labor and Welfare defines these conditions as having lasted for more than six months.


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NEET The acronym for (Not In Education Employment Or Training) The acronym NEET refers to those who have given up and refuse to attend school work or vocational training

Freeter フリーター

Japan's word to describe those who work part-time jobs with low pay and have a hard time earning a living.

Hikikomori 引きこもり

Hikikomori is a Japanese term when translated into English it means pulling inward being confined (Acute social withdrawal) it is Japan's word to describe those who have isolated themselves in their parents house refuse to attend school or work and stay in their bedrooms for very long periods at a time due to social and cultural reasons related to Japanese society (Generally 6 months)

Unemployed Person

A unemployed person is someone who is temporarily unemployed but still seeking out employment looking for a job and is willing to work

Self-Employed Person
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I know this might be a little silly, but does anyone have tips for making friends while being a hikki? I've tried joining discords and other places, but a lot of them feel so heavily occupied that it sets off social anxiety for me and I just can't talk.

It seems hard to find smaller places to make friends while still feeling comfortable. I was just wondering if anyone has any tips, thank you for reading.
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I'm looking for a place like mentioned too. All I have is a small twitter circle of people but something like a discord does sound kind of tempting.


Penpal sites


Try smaller discords, facebook groups, forums, etc. It's also good to look for communities centered around something that interests you, so you already know what topics to break the ice with when starting a conversation.


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These "plz direct me to obscure net circles" threads are always awful, but are there seriously people recommending facebook groups? Listen anonymous; every single hangout on the internet revolves around hobbies. You can browse forums dedicated to knitting cute sweaters, to finding torrent groups willing to share the most FUBR fetish porn vids. Think to yourself what activity on the internet do you partake in the most. If you like saving pictures of anime girls you found on pixiv, *insert imageboard community* exists for that. Despite what some people might tell you, forums and IRC haven't been taken over by reddit or anything of the sort.
>anyone have tips for making friends while being a hikki
For the record, people that "want to be friends on the internet" will want to mic chat with you or pressure you into doing things for them. They want friends that have a skill set. If you don't have any real skills like drawing, music or programming, for example, then they'll probably ghost you or kick you from whatever group you share.


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Well personally I like browsing the sanctionedsuicide forums but I don't know if it counts as a hobby or not.

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I was thinking about Youtubers, Twitch streamers and people who get paid for basically being on the internet and doing something that a monkey could.
These people could easily qualify as NEET, right? They spend up to 8 hours or more a day playing videogames or vlogging or something and most of their income comes from their fans.
Yet nobody really bats an eye at them other than the occasional angry dude that gets way too bent out of shape over people getting money from fans rather than employers. But with NEETs there's a higher level of stigma, telling them they're parasites and that they need to work on themselves and conform. Is the difference really as subtle as simply getting money? Or providing a service, even if it has little to no effect on society and the person's community?
What makes the difference in the way a NEET and someone who turns their hobby and cult of personality into a "job"?
Also have any NEETs here attempted this? Would you?
Is it viable? etc etc
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You have talked yourself into a paranoid delusion about PC costs and functionality. Nothing I can say will talk you out of it because you use it as an excuse for your failings.




>Translation: "I know better what goes on in your country than you do, faggot!"



I think the answer to "Why is it like this" is that most people simply receive their opinions from others by tradition and don't think about things that much themselves, this leads to massive inertia when it comes to 'major' changes to perception and organisation of society. Their opinions are also very much aligned with their own PERCEIVED economic interests - central banks create money out of nothing, lend it to government and banks, creating a 'debt hierarchy' that most people are too busy caught up in climbing to question. Because of the amount of wealth, stability, etc in the world today most people in this hierarchy ARE doing relatively well for themselves (at the expense of those below them), most of these people are also very focused on the idea of climbing high enough in the hierarchy that they can essentially either live without working by relying on those lower in the hierarchy, or live and work for personal fulfillment with an increasingly luxurious lifestyle. NEETS under this system have little to no resources to really even express their views as individuals let alone politically organise to the point of creating coherent and loud enough narratives to 'convince' a bunch of people to stop climbing the hierarchy in the interests of everyone.

This is something you might experience first hand directly from wagies. The wagies in my family all have this internalised mentality that because they work and I don't, they are justified in treating me like dirt, practically. They partly do this because they RESENT the fact that you're surviving without doing the work they are, and probably resent you too for having slightly more independence and strength of character to resist. These people are absorbed in climbing the hierarchy most of the time and so they don't have the time to consider more rational systems. In some funny ways, NEETs have more in common with the super-rich leisure classes than the average person working away at their job, because the elites have time and leisure to consider alternatives.

The irrationality and unfairness of the present system could never be more obvious - I have spoken to multiple people who simply inherited so much money that they'll never have to work a day in their lives, while other people wear their bodies and minds out day after day serving people who are higher up in the hierarchy. Lots of people simply repress any awareness of all of this, though - because as I said they're trying to Post too long. Click here to view the full text.


>What makes the difference in the way a NEET and someone who turns their hobby and cult of personality into a "job"?

One thing about this is that you might not realise it, but a disproportionate amount of those who become successful Youtubers etc today are already from middle\upper-middle class families, with a degree of leisure and enough spare money to try things out without risking falling into poverty. It boils my blood to think of the number of talentless youtubers who get paid by a megacorporation to repeat memes that were made for free by people 10 years ago. They pillage the public sphere for their own selfish purposes, ruining internet culture and prostituting everything, and most of them don't even really need the money.

You're also mostly only seeing the 'successes' when you see these 'Youtube celebs' online. If you look around you can find people who tried hard, and even put in a lot of effort and got nowhere on Youtube, and even then you're looking at those who tried to make a go of things on Youtube, rather than the many more people trapped slaving away in wage labour or stuck in NEET obscurity.


very good post i agree

very good post i agree

i dont like any of the other posts.

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Around 10 years ago, I lived a very reclusive lifestyle and I was very miserable, I don't wanna go on details or to give away who I am, but something happened, something saved me from that, those years I worked hard on redoing my life, I got a job, a future, and became a better person, I had everything you could dream of that would make you happy, and more.
Now I lost all of it, and I'm scared I'll go back to how it was before, how do I go on? I'm not asking for back pats or pity, I just genuinely want to know how do you continue after losing everything.
I honestly want to, I am seeking professional help, and I try to stay focused at work, but nothing is working.


Nothing lasts forever man, not even when life is going good for you. Don’t beat yourself up about it, more than likely it’s something that wasn’t entirely in your control. But hey, look at it this way, if you were able to drag yourself out of being a recluse already what’s stopping you from doing it again? Just don’t give yourself the option of going back to your previous lifestyle, as enticing as it may be at times.


Exact same situation here. I would write many things and I have thought about it so much but in the end it's just that. I have no answers, sadly…


My life's goal is to tell the stories of people like you guys.
Too often we only hear from the people who succeeded, who made it in life, who had the ideal family and kids, house and car, job, status, etc. … the 'winners' in other words… and so we have a natural bias towards those types of people, and it unfairly colours our opinions. But in reality, most people don't win; most people fail, but we never hear from them because they don't make it.
Basically, I'm saying that you have a story worth telling, so for that reason alone, you have a duty to come through this, because I know there's at least one person out there who needs to hear it.

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is compassion contrasted by strength?
I'm too soft and that makes me feel weak


I wouldn't say contrasted. Strong people can afford to be compassionate and forgiving, while weak people need to viciously scrabble around in the dirt for whatever leverage they can find.


Compassion, empathy, is relative to how much you sympathize with someone (or some thing). If you cannot relate to them then you can't have compassion. It's relative to what part of a group you are in. It's meant to keep people or things working together so it adds strength to the group and is not in it's opposite direction at all. An individual is weaker than a large group of sissies. It's why the neanderthals died. They used to eat each other and didn't communicate as well. But were stronger. It didn't save them. They couldn't get along.

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>Been a hikikomori for 11 years
>Been trying to recover for about 2 years now
>I feel like i want to die

I fucking hate my life can anyone relate??.
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>From a secular perspective Einstein's theory of relativity could be taken as proof for a deterministic universe, implying that we don't have free will
Excuse me, what? Einstein's theory of relativity is a mathematical model for the space-time continuum, in what way does it prove there isn't any free will? You just use it to model mechanics in a super precise way.


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>Excuse me, what? Einstein's theory of relativity is a mathematical model for the space-time continuum, in what way does it prove there isn't any free will? You just use it to model mechanics in a super precise way.

If TOR is true then all physical interactions from the atomic to the macroscopic and beyond are causal.
Consciousness arises through some process within the brains of certain animals.
Since the universe is causal; consciousness arises through causality, any "decision" made by a consciousness is predetermined by external inputs and internal feedback loops–themselves determined by external input prior.
Since consciousness is predetermined by causal relation no consciousness can express free will because every "decision" it makes is governed wholly by causal process in the same way that an apple falls from a tree.
Since Humans have consciousness, and are within the universe, human consciousness is governed by causality.
Therefore humans don't have free will as free will requires independence from causality.

Einstein was a philosophical determinist and the implications of relativity are that there is no free will. Einstein:
>The man who is thoroughly convinced of the universal operation of the law of causation cannot for a moment entertain the idea of a being who interferes in the course of events — that is, if he takes the hypothesis of causality really seriously. He has no use for the religion of fear and equally little for social or moral religion. A God who rewards and punishes is inconceivable to him for the simple reason that a man's actions are determined by necessity, external and internal, so that in God's eyes he cannot be responsible, any more than an inanimate object is responsible for the motions it goes through.

See third paragraph under section "Belief in an afterlife."
TOR is not just a tool. If it is an accurate conception of the mechanics of the universe–which there is no reason to currently doubt–it has very profound philosophical implications.


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>If TOR is true then all physical interactions from the atomic to the macroscopic and beyond are causal.
Uh, TOR can't predict anything at atomic level. It's one of the biggest problems in modern physic; how to tie quantum physics with the macro physics of the universe. Also, not all stimuli from the external world is a consequence of a bunch of charged particles with mass running throughout space, humans are rather irrational and quite unpredictable. Laplace's demon theory is interesting as a thought experiment until you consider how modern physics works.

Those quotes by Einstein have nothing to do with the theory in on itself but with his view of the universe. The idea that the universe is deterministic comes from the fact that we can build mathematical models that are by nature deterministic, and what Einstein implies there is that we have to consider the universe deterministic because our models work well with that. But we also have probabilistic models such as the ones used in quantum physics, which don't cross with anything we can perceive in this universe; just because we *see* things it doesn't mean the things we don't see do not exist.
Determinism is just applicable within the model, but even then the model is not necessarily perfect on all cases in the real world. In fact, the model predicts things that aren't necessarily truth at all (the existence of negative mass, for example). Hell, check kirchoff laws and try to explain me why they don't work at high frequencies and how determinism works with any of that, it just doesn't make sense.

It just feels like philosophers love to cherrypick words and concepts without even understanding the underlying implications.


>Feel protected when inside my room
Same. You described my situation perfectly. I think social rejection will contribute to creating an avoidant personality.


>even trying after 11 years

Sounds like quarter or mid life crisis. Accept who you are.

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