>>4639>Every single person within society benefits from it. You don't have to hunt food, you don't have to live in a cave, you have access to modern conveniences, agriculture. If you have access to bread, or domesticated live stock, you benefit from society.
Sounds like bullshit. A farmer growing his own food and having his own livestock is benefitting from society too? Following your logic, he would have access and own those things. Looks like for you basically everything is "society" or a product of it.
People invent thinks, out of love, because they have free time, because they need to solve a problem, whatever, then he tells other people about his invention, and some other people mass produce it to earn money. The perception of this is so different from saying "society did it! you owe everyone this!" that it makes a whole lie. If you are seriously telling me I have a pencil because of society you are lying and miscrediting the people who made the pencil possible, because society is everyone.
I don't owe society anything for having access to bread, if that bread was not stolen, someone made money off of it.
I don't owe society my access to modern conveniences, because society did not create those, inventors did, and enterpreneurs produced and monetized them.
Owing to "society" is so big of a bogus concept you might aswell say we owe it to god, to the spirits, or to nature, because all of them are on the same level of tangibleness.
Society is not a well crafted machine that gifts you things, it is a cumulation of normal human behaviors and interactions in which goods are produced, but these aren't inherent to society and society isn't inherent to these. Humans are always leeches even if they don't realize it, even you in your fetishization of society I doubt you have always given back something of equal value to what you have taken. If all that it takes for you to be at piece of mind is just having some irrelevant dead end piece of shit job good for you, but it won't ever come close to the value of the things you are taking out of your idea of society, you are exchanging 1 cent coins for dollar bills, if you don't think that's leaching you have a problem.
The people who make your idea of "society" go forward are the biggest leeches of them all, lending bogus virtual money and gathering real interest on it. Creating an evergrowing wealth on their name. But I think that this is just too much for you right now, try to process everything else.
Looks like I hit a nerve. You said that society is everyone, but then you said society did not give you anything. That's contradictory. Society is not some kind of entity and it is not tangible. It is everybody's collective effort. However, it is still a thing. It still exists and you still owe it something as long as you continue to reap the benefits of it existing. Are you a farmer? Are you self-sufficient? That analogy doesn't work because a farmer could be self-sufficient. If somebody has the means to provide for himself, good for them. I doubt you are in that position. The inventor contributed to the pencil's creation heavily, but the actual, "wage slaves", made it and allowed you to use it. The idea that, "somebody made money", is moronic. If that money wasn't made by you, you stole from somebody. Without society, life would be short, and miserable. Society exists not because it's creation is some kind of natural inevitability, it exists because people posses the ability to elevate themselves above nature through cooperation. To make life easier. Being a functioning member of society works both in your, and everybody else's interest. This extends to day-to-day interaction. Don't act like a basket case in public.
>Looks like I hit a nerve.
>You said that society is everyone, but then you said society did not give you anything.
Exactly, everyone is part of society, but I don't owe my pencil to everyone. I own the idea of the pencil to the man who invented it, and I own the physical pencil to the entrepeneur that had the idea to mass produce it and worked towards it becoming a reality. I do not own my pencil to Welfare Tyrone and his 6 children, although he is part of society. That's what's misleading about pretending you have something thanks to society. It is as valid as saying I have a pencil thanks to the big bang, or thanks to god. And if you want to shame or coerce someone with that, good luck.
>The inventor contributed to the pencil's creation heavily, but the actual, "wage slaves", made it and allowed you to use it.
The wageslaves don't have the mental and economical means that allowed me to have the pencil I have the pencil thanks to the shepherd that herd them. Would you have said that the animals allowed me to use their meat to eat? Because it's literally the same. The farmer (entrepreneur, architect, inventor) is responsible and has the credit for everything their "wage slaves" do. Because the farmer ORDERED it. The idea, the abstract of it, the directions, all are created by the inventor/entrepeneur, whatever. If you don't accept this as the truth, then we have nothing to debate about.
>The idea that, "somebody made money", is moronic.
Woah, I'm not really going to comment on this one, bravo.
>If that money wasn't made by you, you stole from somebody.
Oh, so if my father gave me money out of free will, I stole it. Is charity something inexistant in your worldview?
>Without society, life would be short, and miserable.
Good thing you cannot be without society as long as there is another single human near you given you both are not enemies. This is on the same level of retardness as saying that without air, life would be short, and miserable. You are really bent on making some kind of cathartic revelation out of something meaningless.
You really have a very warped worldview, I hope you get better.
>>4642>Exactly, everyone is part of society, but I don't owe my pencil to everyone. I own the idea of the pencil to the man who invented it, and I own the physical pencil to the entrepeneur that had the idea to mass produce it and worked towards it becoming a reality. I do not own my pencil to Welfare Tyrone and his 6 children, although he is part of society. That's what's misleading about pretending you have something thanks to society. It is as valid as saying I have a pencil thanks to the big bang, or thanks to god. And if you want to shame or coerce someone with that, good luck.
This is the worst case of stawmanning I have ever seen. Tyrone isn't relevant. If you benefit from society, you should contribute to it. Not every individual may contribute to society, but every benefit of society is the result of the people who contribute to it. You owe those people your own contribution as a means of exchange. Anybody who can work, and is not self-sufficient, should work. >order
No. Every single person who is involved in the process of making something contributed to it. Those people didn't have to do what the entrepreneur, "ordered". That is a massively stupid way of thinking of things. Also, animals are not people. You can't talk to them and they don't make their own decisions. They're lives were chosen for them.>Oh, so if my father gave me money out of free will, I stole it. Is charity something inexistant in your worldview?
Charity? So you think you need charity, huh? If your father gives you money, I feel bad for him. Even if he does it willingly out of the goodness of his heart, taking that money instead of making your own is taking advantage of him. Charity should go to people who can't help themselves. >You are really bent on making some kind of cathartic revelation out of something meaningless.
Society is not something that just exists naturally. It is not oxygen, and it is not just people being near each other. Society is human beings being capable of providing for themselves in an environment isolated from nature. Rather than hunting, you farm. That is society and it has taken thousands of years to develop to its current point. You can't help but make false analogies, huh? >You really have a very warped worldview, I hope you get better.
You're the suicidal one who struggles to answer a simple question.
You sound psychotic and are moving the goalposts so I'm not going to repeat myself.
>This is the worst case of stawmanning I have ever seen. Tyrone isn't relevant. If you benefit from society, you should contribute to it.
Tyrone = society?
Contributing to society = contributing to Tyrone?
I owe this to society = I owe this to tyrone?
See the problem with that?
Or could it be that you decide who is and who isn't part of society and as so he should or shouldn't get "paid" back by contributing? This whole thing is lunatic.
Tyrone is part of society, if you want to be SPECIFIC, use SPECIFIC TERMS and stop saying SOCIETY. Because EVERYONE is SOCIETY.>This is the worst case of stawmanning I have ever seen. Tyrone isn't relevant. If you benefit from society, you should contribute to it.
Which means shit, since it is not on the same level and VALUE. Giving out pennies and receiving dollar bills, what a joke. Thinking you are an upstanding member of society with your mcjob in the same level of a inventor whose deviced had a profound impact on people or saved millions of lives is literally INSANE and PSYCHOTIC. No, sorry but no, these examples are not even close, and saying that both "contribute to society" means shit.>Society is not something that just exists naturally.
It is exactly that, it happened naturally and only possible because of human biology and evolution. Do you know what natural selection means? Newsflash groups of people hunting and waging wars are stronger than individuals doing so, therefore people prone to being "social" reproduced more.>You're the suicidal one who struggles to answer a simple question.
What question and how am I suicidal? Are you OK mate?
Society is not literally everybody. Society is made of everybody's collective effort. Society itself is a state of existing in which human beings do not have to be hunters and gatherers. Being a parasite puts a strain on peoples ability to maintain this state. Either you put a strain on every tax payer, or you put a strain on somebody who does pull their own weight. I never said that everybody contributes equally. This is more strawmanning. You're just using mental gymnastics to justify being dead weight.
Somebody with a mcjob is at least capable of not harming society. They pay their dues for benefiting. I haven't moved any goal posts. Act normal in public, pay for your own stuff. Also, somebody who produces things people actually need is important. Another false analogy. >What question and how am I suicidal? Are you OK mate?
Read your first post again.>If someone asks me how are you, I don't even know what to say>Then, it's like I can heard my soul screaming, screaming like someone who lost his mind, as if someone wanted to try to kill himself just by screaming. It's hard to describe, imagine someone trying to gouge out his eyes and screaming out of panic, out of terror, because the sudden realization of something that's worse than death hit him in a fraction of a second. Something like that.
Not him, but there's literally nothing wrong with being a sponge as long as you can get away with it.
OG NEET lyfe motherfucker
Part of the fault lies on the government and other enablers.
Nightwalks are maximum comfy desu
if we could actually get back on topic that'd be great
Try lying in bed staring at the ceiling for hours because you can't move your limbs
Enjoy feeling waves of nausea/horror/anguish wash over you
Whimper and moan quietly while you do so
Close your eyes and hope that you will be dead soon
While you try to go to sleep, think about all the ways that things can get worse than they already are
i lie to myself and tell myself that my sadness doesnt exist, its just a reflection of the environment around me and nothing exists
Lay in bed and stare at the wall until I grow tired of that or feel hungry. Then stare and scroll through whatever bullshit I can find online until I feel like laying in bed and staring at wall. Repeat until I'm too tired, fall asleep, then start again in the morning.
When I'm feeling depressed, I'm usually wandering on the net. It allows me to abstract from everything.
By the way, I've found that the whole site was blocked because of the one picture (https://reestr.rublacklist.net/record/1786178/
), so making me able to enter this site only by using proxy/VPN. Снова закручивают гайки :(
but all of those things are fucking awesome anon, those are the things that make life worth living, the things that make it so great to be a NEET
i sit and stare at my steam library looking for a game to distract myself with until im tired enough to go to bed
then i sit and play on my phone for a few hours instead of trying to sleep
I met my girlfriend around 3 months ago, and I had the best time of my life by far with her. I never expected I could love someone as much as I love her, it's crazy when I think about it, it's like I found a completely hidden part of 'life'.
Recently things are quite hard for us, she's facing a ton of life-changing problems/situations, and even trying my best to support her, it feels like I either make no impact at all or make things worse and just become another burden for her. This feeling is truly crushing, she says she always tells me what she needs, and when I do it, it's like I either did it wrong, or completely missed the point and did the opposite. I'm as inexperienced as they come, and this is my first relationship, but I'm completely torn if I'm just some absolutely smooth-brained retard or people become a million times more complicated to deal with when they are facing some serious problems. It really breaks me.
It gets me seriously depressed when I feel like I screwed up something or when I didn't do the right thing at the time, even when trying my absolute hardest and already having something similar happening in the past wich I could learn from, but having my choice still being the worst possible.
Second time ever and first time in over 5 years I've seriously considered suicide, I can't sleep more than 4 hours at night no matter what method I try, and university stuff just makes things harder.
Given most of this negativity is related to our relationship, I try to talk things out with her as much as possible so I can stop screwing up and help her, wich makes me feel great when I manage.
When talking is not an option, I just feel like doing absolutely nothing. I lay on bed looking at the ceiling, try to sleep, turn on the pc and then off after 15 minutes or so because I can't force myself to do anything at all, can't play, can't watch anime, can't read manga, can't study or do projects, can't eat…
When the depression is lower like now, I can do more of this stuff, so now I'm venting on ubuu while listening to Starset, waiting the time to pass so I can go to class and just accept the day as over.
I usually just wallow in bed or watch something comforting and fall asleep
i listen to this vocaloid playlist i found a while ago https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLs6zTpuet7jdhmrzGsPYfXFe2FAyeRAaU
and wallow in misery
I've never been depressed before
Although if I am feeling down usually some good food and music/games help
nothing, that being said i also do nothing when i'm happy/afraid/enraged/etc.
Listen to music, go for a walk, maybe look at pretty pictures online, such as this one>>5982
What state of mind do you need to be to do something?
I'm in a fairly constant state of depression, so basically what I do all the time anyway.
>>5985>What state of mind do you need to be to do something?
Never really thought about that. usually in the rare case where i'm prompted to do something is due to huge amounts of external efforts, if it were for me, i would probably live doing nothing until i died.
>>5993>i would probably live doing nothing until i died.
Can't really fault you for that, the hikki life is far from an happy life, but it's not a painful one either, probably
. If you don't mind me asking, I assume most of the external efforts come from family members? at least that's my case.>>5999
Slavic life is a sad life. This has helped me understand how slavic writers come to be.
>>6006>I assume most of the external efforts come from family members?
That used to be the case until i was admitted into a psych ward, since then i kind of lounge around the house without them trying to make me do something, it is kind of liberating but to be frank the prospect of slowly losing everything i have and know fills me with dread but as i am legally a useless ill person i can do nothing about it. i never wanted this kind of life but it is the life that i have lived for years.
>>5999>could seek shelter in the West and find solace there
I don't know what do you consider "the West", but if, for example, the EU, then you should know that the society here is just as rotten as the infrastructure of the place on your photo. That, combined with nanny state style "we know better what's best for you, and we will shove it down your throat, you like it or not" government policies, is a recipe for disaster.
Don't get me wrong, I understand that the place where you are now must be a living nightmare, and you should get out ASAP. I'm just saying, as an EU citizen, that you shouldn't come here, because these countries are shitholes on their own. And me (and many others) are desperately trying to escape.
(Not to mention that they wouldn't like you anyway. Asylum seekers who have a valid reason for their escape have no chance here. Only the ones that are embraced, and then used as tools of propaganda, by the ultra-liberal NGOs are allowed in…)
For start, do you have any chance to move out of the area, and let's say, move into one of them small summer residences (I forgot what they are called in your area)? Perhaps getting away from the urban toxic dump would help you regaining your composition, and plan/prepare for the next move.
>>6006>Slavic life is a sad life.
Indeed, yet the majority of people seem to accept such life, bear with having a minimum wage of $120-130 per month and feel like nothing is wrong about it, taking several loans, drowning in mortgage from toes to head and procreating.>>6008>society here is just as rotten as the infrastructure of the place on your photo
I'm aware of it, but I care about a much better quality of life rather than society. People are evil, selfish and pathetic by nature, yet the living standards tend to differ from place to place.>you shouldn't come here>they wouldn't like you
I partially agree with you on this matter since decent life can be achieved in post-Soviet twatholes somewhat easier in comparison to first world countries, but I've simply given up on working my ass off toward living a better life. I would not even flee the country if I had a choice, instead I would prefer to keep rotting until I run out of money, and I have already wasted some of it on buying a thick rope anyway.>small summer residences
I suppose you meant so-called «dachas». It is a privilege of the rich to dispose of a small plot of land. Not specifically «rich», but I don't happen to have one.>plan/prepare for the next move
I learned English at my leisure solely out of boredom, but I don't consider it an achievement of some kind. I could and still can, for sure, become a freelancer and start earning a living, yet I play video games and browse imageboards most of the time, live at my single relative's expense waiting for the inevitable to happen in a matter of one year. Not interested in acquiring new skills at all. Also, I don't want to whine about my deteriorating condition, lack of proper health care in my hellhole, money, several physical and mental diseases, but I'm sure it would have been more endurable if I was born into a relatively rich or at least mid-class family. But if I had a chance, I'd prefer not to be born at all.
>>6009>I care about a much better quality of life rather than society
Well, I guess "quality of life" is subjective. I would rather live a simple life, in a simple place, surrounded by simple people, instead of living in a dystopian shithole that is only beautiful on the surface.
Besides, still on the topic of the EU, don't believe the propaganda bullshit. There's no free education here, there's no free healthcare here. And, just like in your country, there's no way to find any job that is not borderline slavery if you are born into the wrong family, or if you lack an extensive network of influental friends.
If you are not privileged, everything you see is out of reach for you. The government won't give a shit about your conditions or situation, you are only permitted to obey, but not to ask.
If you are not privileged, there's no way out.
>I suppose you meant so-called «dachas».
Yep, that's what I was thinking of. "Good" to know they are only available for certain classes. I thought they are normally inhabited by people who had it with urban life, but can't move too far from cities because of work or so.
>>6010>There's no free education here, there's no free healthcare here.
As for health care, I'm prone to believing that it's actually paid, that's completely fine. However, what about countries with tuition-free universities, such as Germany? As far as I have read about Germany's education system, the country allows people from any shithole to study for free as long as they're willing to learn the language.>If you are not privileged, everything you see is out of reach for you.>If you are not privileged, there's no way out.
I do realise it all comes down to privileges one has. By the way, I am by no means an ally of Socialism; on the contrary, I find today's economic system taking place in some post-Soviet countries, including the one I'm residing in, quite positive rather than negative. It is possible for anyone to start from the bottom and become wealthy at some point in the future if one really has a genuine passion for that and goals in life they want to pursue. Unfortunately, I have lost all hope that I can change myself, and I'm not willing to even try taking some steps to fix the situation I'm stuck in.>"Good" to know they are only available for certain classes
It was stupid of me to state that «dachas» can be acquired exclusively by the rich. I'm sure that plenty of people who live ten times worse than I do possess some dacha, maybe even more than just one, thanks to their parents' legacy. In addition, given that Russia is enormous in size, there's a plethora of abandoned villages with more or less comfortable «izbas» so it's possible to illegally survive there until one gets eaten by a pack of stray dogs or catches a cold and dies.
>>6011>However, what about countries with tuition-free universities, such as Germany?
I'm not exactly familiar with the Germans. But as far as I'm concerned (and in my present country of residence, for example), to qualify for "free" education, you still have to fulfil certain requirements. Like you have to be below a certain age (I thik it was 25), you have to have qualifications that are compatible with theirs (if you don't, you have to sit for some exams, most likely for shitloads of money), and you have to provide a statement of financial stability (and no, getting a part-time job there will definitely not do the trick).
>By the way, I am by no means an ally of Socialism
Me neither, in fact I'm completely apolitical. Not only that, I believe politics are the #1 reason why humankind is unable to move forward. It's like spoiled children having an argument in the sandbox, but on a global scale, with actual human beings in place of toys…
>Unfortunately, I have lost all hope that I can change myself, and I'm not willing to even try taking some steps to fix the situation I'm stuck in.
I see, and it's really sad to hear that. I was suggesting a change of atmosphere because I know, from experience, how it could change everything.
And I still hope that one day you will be able to change your ways.
Only the skilled and healthy have the right to survive, natural selection as it is. Can't say it's bad, parasites like myself are just not suitable for this world. I hope your situation in life is not as bleak and dismal.
Thanks for taking the time to have a conversation with me, anon. Sent you a virtual hug.
Hookers, hustlers and the already rich are not "skilled" nor "healthy". They may have the right to survive over me, but I refuse to subscribe to the idea that I'm "broken" for being unsuccessful because all that held me back in life is honesty and principles.
Honestly fuck the "work hard and you'll be successful" fairytale. "Hard work" means doing literally anything is needed to advance your position. It doesn't mean honest, hard work.
Not really helpful and I'm sorry about that, but I basically just do what I'm doing now. Depression is a fairly constant thing for me and is only really noticeable when I'm having my particularly bad days or I've had a really good 5-50 minutes then go back to normal.
If I catch it coming on early, I skate in the garage of my apartment building until I feel a little more in control.
If I fuck up and let it take over, I just spend the day in bed doing low-effort shit on my phone. Reading manga I don't like, articles that aren't too interesting.
Scream to myself about how I want to just kill everyone and myself. Usually after that shitshow is done I watch anime to cheer myself up
Wait for nighttime to come so that the sweet embrace of sleep and good dreams can take me away. There have been very few days where I actually look forward too waking up the next day since all my brain does is to create new problems
Recommend some imageboards.
Feeling down is temporary and occurs sometimes at best. Depression affects all facets of life and it becomes the default state. Depression is when sadness becomes the standard of your life and happiness is the exception.
Atleast you had a girlfriends and have active friends to cry to.
I agree, especially with last point. My brain always focusses on the negatives and accepting happiness and become alien for it.
I still shower, brush and maintain my daily hygiene. Sometimes it makes me temporarily but no significant changes in the long run. I guess I do these activities to convince myself that I am actively doing something productive
I see. Does it help? Also, do you do meditation of any kind?
Some people have a gene that allows them to function on less sleep. Do you feel drowsy and/or less productive during the day?