It's finally done. Shoujo Gidan is translated and the english version is released. Many thanks to all the people who helped with the production of this patch.https://www.mediafire.com/?eq78lbw09r49a2e
The game is a sequel to Shoujo Kidan, and works in a similar fashion, albeit slightly differently. Although it's not necessary to have played the previous game, it is recommended. I've included the original hint file made by lol plus a guide I originally made for testers. If any question or problem arises, feel free to post them here.
Well done fag, thank you for this.
Thank you for all your hard work.
i'm going to cry. may you be blessed in all your future endeavors friend.
thought nobody was going to translate, nice work
are you the same guy who posted somewhere on /og/ for testers to email?
feelsbadman was busy all day
I announced a while back in /fg/ and here >>4504
and also asked for help a few replies below that one.
It's taken a lot of time but it's finally done.>>4794
Yes, only 01
what the fuck was up with the ending though
and "tsukiko"'s identity disorder
>>4796>what the fuck was up with the ending though
Hehehe, there's a reason the title is Fake story
Check the last hint (readme.html → hints) or the last part of the guide, if you don't want to play the whole thing again.
yea back when i played untranslated gidan i extracted the game and looked in graphics in images so i kinda was kept in the dark/unsure about the identity of "tsukiko"
because her sprite was named $youkohokou
but nonetheless i didn't look too far into it until i finished the game
i'm glad lol keeped the fuckery of the ああああああ route, Shoujo Kidan/Gidan Marisa is best Marisa.
I don't understand who is who anymore.
average lol's game with mindfuck endings
i stil remember the shitshow about .flow's endings, though
For those who don't understand anything, just play the other route, it's literally the last hint.
Soooo, massive spoiler dump here, if spoilers get badly formatted and don't show up as black boxes, mods please delete my post so people don't get their experience ruined.
What the fuck? So as we clearly know Gidan is a sequel to Kidan. Honestly, i didn't pay attention to much of the plot in Kidan except for the ghost (which i assume is Kanako) and the identity of the person telling you the story and killed you if you were in a normal run (which, when i played Kidan, i assumed was Tsukiko, but since she shares the same design with Youko or "Tsukiko", ill assume she's Youko) and the notes left behind by what i assume was left behind by Shuichiro, so my mind might be a bit fuzzy. The thing that bothers me in both of these games is the identity of the main character, both the girl in Kidan and the time-travelling dimension-breaking girl in Gidan, i don't get any idea who the fuck they are (Youko run sorta implies the girl is…herself? She can also revive herself like the girl…say what?) and the logistics are too confusing to think about at the moment. The moment where Shuichiro tells you about what happened to Kanako and how she was killed eerily resembles a dialogue by what i assume is Youko in Kidan where she tells you how Kanako was killed. It seems Youko/Main protagonist is stuck in some sort of limbo world (the box?) with extremely disfigured buildings. In Kidan, even though there were hints of the paranormal, it didn't go as far as Gidan. The story behind Kidan is quite simple, but in Gidan the logistics are all over the place (honestly a thing that i kinda like, i like puzzles) and Time-traveling dimension-breaking main girl just suddenly ends up in that "limbo" like place (floor is broken and shit) and she ends up meeting some sort of evil Shuichiro and actual Tsukiko with boxes on their heads, and she ends up getting stuck inside a box and needs to escape, i assume. It seems Youko/Amadzu Tsukiko are 2 different personalities, she probably named herself after Tsukiko because of the documents scattered about the location referencing Youko. If you press A multiple times in the beginning, she seems to not want to take off her gloves (blood?) idk really. She seems relatively normal albeit disturbed by the beginning of the game and she starts to behave weirdly towards the end of the game (because she obviously is the killer…or is she?) but a thing that kinda spooked up my mind when playing the Youko route and replaying the game was how she pratically killed herself in Youko run and became coat-wearing psycho with a nice hat (Which i assume is actual Youko, the other Youko (rather, Tsukiko) is just a deluded Youko) and how, when she shows up to kill the Main Protagonist she's obviously a psycho wearing a coat but without the nice hat (a box, rather) but she says the "one you saw in the Infirmary was rather a different woman", what the fuck? Anyways i'm just spouting theory fuel here, let's hope it gets properly spoiled.
Honestly while Shoujo Kidan/Shoujo Gidan is nice, the real beauty lies in the ああああああ routes, it kinda has the silliness the game lacks really.
.flow was very much darker compared to Yume Nikki, but nonetheless it had those chill/calming moments and maps such as the Famicom World/Underwater/Snow/Sugar Hole maps, it kinda makes .flow not seem the nightmare simulator people hype it to be.
Kidan relies more on the paranormal factor and there isn't much calming moments, it's a horror game from start to finish.
Gidan, while in comparison to Kidan is a much better game, while it still relies on the mental factor, there's much more gore and body horror in comparison to Kidan, so the experience is much more unnerving, but both games lack that "spacing" .flow has. I'm not talking about the wait between the true horror moments, both games do that very well, i'm talking about the "Show a calm, serene place -> Show a really messed up place/event" thing .flow did. It kinda gave it more personality and made .flow deeper than the first glance.
I love these games though and the ああああああ route fulfilled my crave, even though it delivered in a different area (silliness instead of calm, chill spacing), it was really enjoyable and made the game funnier i guess, running gag with Kidan as well.
After playing the game so many times and pondering about the dialogues for so much, I came to understand most
of the plot, although there are some holes and naturally those are filled with what I believe they are rather than what they may really be, so be warned, this is only speculation based on all the information I digested when translating this and my own personal theory. I'd recommend playing the game and formulating your own theories before reading this.WARNING MAJOR SPOILERS - READ ONLY IF YOU PLAYED BOTH ROUTES
It goes more or less like this:
Prologue: There are three sisters, Minako (the oldest), Kanako (the albino), and Tsukiko (the youngest), plus Shuichiro. It's not specified what are their circumstances or where they were before any of the games, but for some reason Shuichiro ended taking care of Kanako as the heir of the family in the house of this village. Tsukiko is apparently away, just as Minako was away too. Again, "apparently", since they aren't mentioned anywhere thus I assume this.They seem to be part of a family bestowed with the mission of Protecting the village through carrying some sort of ritual involving a box. Henceforth, I will refer to this household by their name, the Iwamotos.After some time, "Anotsu" (?) Youko (I'm guessing that's her real famiy name) started working as a maid in the Iwamoto house, under the name Amadzu Youko. She meets Kanako and takes care of her along Chizuyo (a maid) and Shuichiro. She falls in love with Shuichiro and goes as far as offering herself to become the new Miko in this box ritual, to help him to change the village. Now, I suppose everybody has read the procedures, well, they're carried off exactly as described. It's some sort of hardcore ceremony involving gutting and cutting of fingers (the reason she uses gloves, sorry, she has no blood on her hands, and for the record, it's the tip apparently, check the "About this game" text file), creating a box and then listening to the voice of that box and passing that to the villagers. Interesting enough, this may imply the box is a Kami (The duty of a miko is, after all, to listen the voice of the Kami, among other things). Again, this is my own personal opinion, the girl could be completely nuts for all we know. I'm more inclined to believe "the box" is a separate entity, though.Long story short, Youko survives and becomes the Miko without apparently going mad ("apparently", for other people). She then seems to carry her duty as the voice of the Box, but it seems she keeps visting the Iwamotos (probably for official things since they're the protective household) as mentioned by Chizuyo, although she's "different", more "sharp", evidently hinting that as either a byproduct of her interaction with the box, OR the box entity manifesting through her body. So then Youko feels jealous over Kanako for being "poured" in Shuichiro's love, while she (who sacrificed so much) receives so little from him instead. She snitches her outings with the fatty merchant and he starts visiting Kanako on her room, until he tries to rape her and she defends herself with that nail hammer. Yadda yadda, chaos breaks, the guy kills Kanako and a few other family members before being beheaded by Shuichiro. He gets triggered and starts blaming the village and the traditions for making Kanako carry the "Demon Child" curse and, sooner or later (not specified) breaks the box, and then abandons the village. It's never been specified what the hell happened in the village, but the gossip magazines talk about a discovery of a massive number corpses; whatever happened, it destroyed the village literally, and the box mentions it too (see file).
>>4807Shuichiro goes back to ask for help with other family members, but specially Minako. They both agree not to tell Tsukiko anything about what happened, he gets a free house and both return to the village to pay a visit to Kanako's tomb (How or who made the tomb is never specified, after all, wasn't the village destroyed? Then again, it could have happened after that but the box says he abandoned the place AFTER destroying the box, and that happens just before shit goes sour for the village. I think there's a chance Youko built that tomb out of guilt, but then again, I can't back this up). Whatever, it seems that when they go back to the village.
Kidan: Minako goes back to the household and gets nuts for some reason. She's the girl with the sailor uniform, and thinks she's actually Kanako or something (that's why the name "Minako" triggers a "Return to Title" game over). Tsukiko (The real Tsukiko) finishes her off (The box teases her about this, claiming they're the same and that's she's even a finer murderer since she killed a blood relative).
Before Gidan: Shuichiro and Tsukiko return from the village and start living in that house the family gave them. Youko starts sending them threatening letters. Things keep escalating, until she goes to their house. This is where Youko's route starts.
Gidan: The whole game happens during Youko's last moments. It seems nobody has noticed, but the interviews with the box-on-head Shuichiro/Tsukiko on the main route are actually replying to what the real Tsukiko and Shuichiro ask/tell Youko in her route. I personally think they're just the box taking another form and their sole purpose seems to be filling the "blank noise" of Youko's interviews with the real Iwamotos. Oh also, Youko is lying on the floor coughing during the second interview in the main route (after the safebox in the warehouse full of boxes). If I recall correctly, this happens during the time the box (Youko with that red hat) comes out in Youko's route.So yeah, I never got why killing the protagonist validates Youko's lie, or what her lie is, precisely. I mean, sure, we know her sin, she snitched Kanako's outing, but why killing some faceless girl would fix that? Either way, the box pushes Youko to kill her. She prepares the whole game and sets every trap, then pretends to be called Tsukiko (probably just for the kicks, PROBABLY, I am not sure). It doesn't show too much with the translation, but Youko uses a very polite, albeit slightly off speech (which makes the protagonist wonder if she's from the countryside). This speech, however, occasionally goes very rough and aggressive (If you input the numerical password of the Storehouse without asking her the last digits, when you pick up the phone in the break room, when you find the letter, etc.), which I originally translated this by cuting g's in ing's but it made her talk like a redneck and didn't blend too well. So yeah, this is the same speech The Box uses when talking with the Iwamotos. Also, The Box uses a few words that make her sounds slightly archaic (very slightly), hinting that she's very, very old, and why I believe she's a separate entity.Long story short, the game is divided in three planes (4 if you count the intro/ending scenes). The Box 1, where the main game happens, The Box 2, where Youko is trapped (the real Youko), and the real world, where Suichiro and Tsukiko are. It's implied that Box 1 is a loop that happens everytime you run the game with a random name, while Box 2 is what happens when Youko gets tired of it.
The rest is pretty much the ending, which is easy to see. Either Youko went nuts or she was lying, it's up to you to decide.
Now, I have a more interesting question: WHO IS THIS (file 2)? And who is the protagonist? I'd be interested in knowing what you guys think about it.
1 question OP, how did you go about translating stuff in VX?
I wish to translate Gidan to Portuguese because some friends want to play it (but they don't understand English that well) but unlike RM2k3 you just can't open it and edit the events, etc.
The list goes like this:
1- Contact the Author if you're thinking in publishing this (which I recommend if you're going to spend hours sitting in front of a computer typing and editing pictures like a slave). lol understands english if it isn't too complicated, and if you want I can translate your request to Japanese. His site is in the "about this game.txt" file.
2- This depends on what you find the most comfortable. If you want to edit event by event, download RPGmemer VX, create a new project, and copy that .project file into the directory with the executable of the game, that will let you edit things just like with rm2k. Warning: I did not translate a single map name, so you will probably have problems navigating through that without Japanese knowledge.
I recommend however to download RPGTrans, create a patch and work with that. It's much easier since you only have to translate things once, that means that if there are events with the same line in different parts of the game you don't need to translate each separately.
Oh, you will notice two escape sequence on every line spoken
by a character, "\B" and "\C". Long story short, the game uses \B to activate a script to produce a sound (the sound you hear as letters appear on the screen), and that only works with non-ASCII characters. The original version did not have any problems with this, but when making making this patch I realized that the \B sequence ate the word following it and didn't activate anything, so I fixed that by adding an escape sequence that sets the color of the text (in this case, "0", or white), thus "\B\C". Be careful by mixing lines that have this pair with those that don't. Also, for the love of god, DO NOT touch the comments with japanese on them, they set the mini-window above dialogue to display Amadzu Tsukiko's name.
3- Whatever method you used, open the patched game with RPGmemer and compress it as encrypted.
was the "ALL YOUR BASE ARE BELONG TO US" screen in original Gidan? nice meme'ing on lol's part if it was.
I believe that person is The Box itself. He appears when your being chased by Tsukiko, and she puts a box on her head, and that person appears, wondering about the nature of the limbo the protagonist is stuck in, and referring to Youko as a different person. Plus, in the ending IIRC The Box is talking to Youko. I still don't know what the hell the "I want to leave"/"I want to stay" options do.
All the text on the computer was originally in English.>>4820What puzzles me, though, is that the uniform of the box (as seen in that ending) is different from that of the person with the blue mark, which seems to imply they aren't the same person. Also, their speech patterns are different too. But that may be just me.
Anyone else think this might be in the same 'setting' as .flow?
The computer you use to unlock the doors has 'flow' written on it, and then there's Kanako, who seems to have a similar condition that Sabitsuki had.
I think it all fits.
If I recall correctly, the computer only says "Rust Electronics". But let's assume it's the same universe, Sabitsuki has a relatively modern computer, while ki/gidan are set in the shouwa era (mid 70's, to be more precise).
>and then there's Kanako, who seems to have a similar condition that Sabitsuki had.
Kanako was just an albino, she didn't have some other problem other than being shunned for being different. You could argue Sabi is only an albino too and the whole game is just her mental health going nuts and you'd have a point, but that doesn't seem to be the case considering the endings and the maids.
The paper you need to read as a hint for the computer has 'flow' and 'smile' written on it. Probably just an easter egg though.
Kanako could just be an albino and it's lol's fetish, but she could also have some sort of early form of the rust disease. Perhaps she was patient zero?
But yeah maybe you're right.
Oh wait I just remembered
Kanako is stated multiple times to be very sickly; she can't even go out in sun.
this is really silly>>4826
albinos normally can't go out on the sun because of their sensitive skin, people just thought she was cursed because she was "different"
this is the continuation of >>4827
see pic related
this is more of lol's style than anything
there are some easter eggs there and there about .flow (like the iron pipe gag) but it's more a YN FG including a Madotsuki room or something like that; they are not connected (tinfoil: they actually could be and it's part of a complicated canon but we have no info on that)
>>4808>Who is the protagonist
So after finishing all routes a while ago, i decided to replay Gidan for the heck of it.
I deleted all my savedata so this is just a clean 1st playthrough.
So, in the intro sequence, something got my attention.
So i think we all know the intro sequence is actually a cut version of Youko entering the house
up till the name select screen.
If you choose Youko
the game will show you the full text.
If you normally choose a name, the game will show you the cut text.
After the intro sequence, you go through a sort of household and talk with Box!Shuichiro and Box!Tsukiko, who say cut things about Youko's interview
and then you get teleported to the main-game.
Not only does the dialogue mention the girl having basically no memory at all, the interaction with The Box basically confirms the protagonist has some kind of memory issue/amnesia.
When you enter Youko
, the game seems to "remember" the dialogue. Youko
also suspiciously has the exact same weird revival power
as the Protagonist.Youko
in her route also seems to show a WAY different behaviour to the Youko in the main route, which shows a really "off" behaviour
So, my personal belief is that the protagonist is actually the real Youko, not the one you meet in the main route
and the intro sequence is her remembering her identity or not
and after entering a random name, i.e she doesn't remember her name
she suffers some sort of memory loss, that Youko was already sort of experiencing in her route. It should be mentioned that after she gets killed by Box!Youko and revives, she breaks down a little.
and enters the household once again, this time with a fuzzied out memory and, since the setting of the main route isn't really in the "real world", rather inside a "The Box 1" as you said, Shuichiro and Tsukiko get replaced by their Box selves.
After the girl gets trapped inside the rusted box and goes through the main route, you can clearly tell The Youko (which is pretty much Box!Youko as you can see by the Youko Route) in the main route is having some weird personality switches, between Box!Youko & the supposedly real Youko, although even then she still feels very off
and in the main route ending Box!Youko fully takes over and kills the protagonist, but the protagonist/Youko has the infinite revival power and pretty much spams A/revive until i think it was Shuichiro? finishes Box!Youko off.
So TL;DR:Protagonist is actually Youko when she doesn't remember who she is, main route Youko is the corrupted "Box!Youko" entity, BBBBBB is best characterBefore making this theory up, i thought The Protagonist was a weird creation of The Box with no identity really. The reasoning behind that was that she didn't appear on the real world, so yeh.
For other questions, Why do i feel the facility on the main route is based on a place on the real world? Or is it all some creation by Box!Youko so she could play games with the protagonist?
It seems plausible, although there's still something kind of contradictory, or at least something I can't answer given this supposition. "The Box" insists that all Youko needs to do is to kill the girl. Why would Youko need to kill her alter ego? Also, The Blue Coat Box in the middle of the game (during the "I want to leave/I want to stay" branching) mentions that "The Fake Youko" (AKA the box) wants to kill her to reaffirm her lie. How does that exactly work if we assume the little girl is, in fact, Youko?
Also, I could be wrong (I already forgot how it worked), but the girl mentioning "she knows something about the box" but "doesn't want to remember" happens after you select any name for the first time. If you play your very, very first time, she will NOT mention this, so I'm guessing you haven't either cleaned the save files correctly, or you've input another name before playing that route (could it be you tried playing Youko's route first?).
Again, I may be wrong, but I'm pretty confident that that happened after playing with a name and not the other way around
As for your question:There isn't a single mention anywhere that the facility may be real. It's interesting to note that computers weren't well known by many people (specially in pre-Toyotism Shouwa), and much less used in places similar to jails. My guess is that it isn't real, but just an invention made up from things Youko may have read about. She does mention she read something about computers, after all. So it's probably her (or the box's) image of a hi-security facility.
So I just played this and
I FUCKING LOVE NOT-MARISA
Is there a version of this that doesn't require the RTP to be installed?
I haven't done it, and I doubt anybody else has bothered (or at least they haven't announced anywhere I could see it), so probably no.
Can't get this to show up in the Neko Player for my phone. Being a Cybergypsy wimps!
I might be the rare person who actually likes Kidan better than Gidan, but nevertheless, Gidan was a great experience. Not just as an enjoyable, challenging but not overly difficult game with an intriguing puzzle of a storyline including some interesting(ly horrific) bits of Japanese culture, but a great experience in seeing how lol has evolved in gamemaking since .flow. I can't wait to see what lol's next project will be. I'd be interested in seeing something a little different than another blood-and-gore horror exploration game, but I wouldn't exactly complain about getting another, either; these games so far, but especially Kidan and Gidan, have really just right up my alley.
…Now if only I could just figure out what the fuck Gidan's deal is… I'm gonna be scratching my head over this game for days. Damn you, lol! (But it's all part of the fun in the end, really.)
overly sappy anon out
If you look at his twitter it seems he's making a 'shump
I don't understand moon but it retains the general aesthetic of the past games he made
The coat isn't actually blue, it looks more black/dark grey and the environment just make it look blue. Also bigger coat is actually because the sprite is slightly zoomed in, you can see it if you examine the sprite closely, the pixels are all enlargened by a bit compared to the "smaller" sprite.
So basically they're all the same person and it's just color perception stuff and maybe a zoom error on the sprite or something.
Ya dingus, I never said the coat IS blue, I said it had a blue mark over it. Also, they're not the same file resized, the body shape is different in each and the blue-stained coat has some sort of "corrupted" filter over it. Also, the filename for the blue-stained coat figure is 箱男 (box man), while the other is 陽子箱 (Yōko box). It actually looks like this "box man" is Shuichirō while the other is obviously Yōko. Their speech pattern is different too.
They're definitively not the same person, or at least they aren't portrayed as having the same personality.
Also, there was somebody asking how to get Yōko's distrust. Just be sulky, if she ask for cooperation tell her no, if she asks what you think of murdering call 'em crazy nuts, etc.
The original didn't imply any gender. It uses the japanese noun for child (子供), but I'm pretty sure it actually refers to Shuichiro and how he left the village
, therefore why I chose "him". If you played to the end of the game/alternative route, you will notice that these dialogues reply to what the questions in the real world and have a slight sarcastic tone. Here's the original text, maybe it will refresh some things now that I told you that.
"There was a child who didn't seem to remember me, you know. I met him when he was really little, so it couldn't be helped…"
Literally: "There was this child who doesn't remember me. It was long ago, and (that person) was still a child (back then) so it can't be helped"
"He was the first of his family to flee the village that day…"
Literally: "That day, (that child was the) very first family member in running away…"
"The day you killed that village big shot…"Surprise surprise, remember who did it?
"The day our household was destroyed…"
"The day the box was broken…"
"The day my village was broken…"
"Ah…was it the death anniversary of your little sister? That was such a shame…"There's a sister that died, remember?
"Had you been smarter, maybe that thing wouldn't have happened…"
"Ahaha… after all, it isn't limited to the death of your sister only…"i.e. the sister wasn't the only one who died because of the fuck-up
"That day, the child abandoned the village, and was the first of the family to run away. Do you want to hear… what happened after that?"
It's confusing because the "you" and "that person" are intermingled constantly. When I read it the first time this is the feeling I got, that the box was being sarcasting and saying "There was this guy, you know, who completely fucked up and then ran away asap. D'you know who I mean?", but now that you're pointing this out, the "was too young" part annoys me a little. If my memory doesn't fail, when I translated it it sounded like she was reproaching him that he forgot about her, but now that I read this without all the context of the game (I've forgotten a bunch of details), it's a bit harder to digest.>>5034
This was done in the traditional way. If I recall correctly, lol had a few problems with making it but was satisfied with the result.
Thanks for the thorough clarification. I hadn't made the connection that the mentioned child might be Shuichiro myself… that does make more sense, but I'm still wondering if that's really who they're referring to. Surely there would be no need to use "that child" instead of "you (Shuichiro)" if they were talking about Shuichiro specifically? I can only guess though. It's hard to take anything certain in a game like this.
While I'm tossing out ideas: I had an idea that the protag and Tsukiko might be related in some form. Mostly from stuff like similar sprites (overworld and talksprites), appearances (similar dress, color scheme, and hair style), Yoko mentioning that Tsukiko "looks like the kids she killed"
, and Yoko using Tsukiko's name of all names to disguise her identity with for no clearly apparent reason
. I'm not very confident in this idea, though; it's admittedly a bit of a reach in my probably doomed quest to try and figure out the protagonist's deal.
It is curious that Yoko picks Tsukiko's name to disguise her identity with
, though. Maybe it's supposed to be a meta trick sort of thing to screw with the players coming from Kidan? It might fit in with the protag implied to be a blank state and/or a fabrication… Maybe the protag is just supposed to literally represent the player? But it's also curious that she'd have many design similarities to Tsukiko (plus that telling line from Yoko)… unless that's just another part of the Tsukiko confusion thing…
Ah, I don't know. I don't know anything about this game. I'm just throwing out ideas; maybe someone smarter than me will be able to make some use of them.
Both Yoko's and Box Man's talksprites do have the same body shape. Box Man's is literally just Yoko's zoomed in with the blue mark and a filter slapped on top. It's obvious if you compare the buttons and the outline of the coats.
Sorry, I mistranslated the first sentence when I did the literal translation. It says:
"There was this child who doesn't remember me. When we met long ago, (that person) was a mere child so it can't be helped…">>5038
Actually, now that you're pointing this out I'm kind of regretting choosing a pronoun when translating it instead of making it neutral. Admittedly, I tried (along with the person who helped me correct the english) to make it flow more naturally and not sound so weird, and going by "that person" and such all the time didn't go as good as just choosing a pronoun. It was also longer and I didn't want to add any unnecessary lines of text unless I had to. However, now I'm realizing that I unconsciously imposed my view of the game's plot into it. Thankfully the game is completely open-minded and you can connect all the dots you want regardless of what's being said (because the game is ultimately a big lie and bits of truth), so feel free to think I was wrong there.
>While I'm tossing out ideas: I had an idea that the protag and Tsukiko might be related in some form.
I also thought about it. Their appearance is too similar. My main problem with this though is why killing Tsukiko's doppelgänger validates Yōko's lie. I mean, she's mad at the whole family, and I even dare to say Shuichiro's the one she resents the most.
Now that's interesting, I assumed she implied the kids in the village but it could very well mean the protagonist.
>Maybe it's supposed to be a meta trick sort of thing to screw with the players coming from Kidan?
You know, when I played it for the very first time I thought it was really Tsukiko, just that she had grown up. I'm pretty sure lol chose to do that on purpose, because it worked wonders. Or at least made the decision knowing the underlying implications. >>5039
The scale factor between both images is 115/104 =~ 1.105(769230) (multiply Yōko's image size for that and her box will match the box man size almost perfectly save for resize uncertainty). The shape is not the same, the box man's body is bigger than Yōko's, and he's got a red glow coming from the eyes while Yōko doesn't. And the fact that one is officially called "box man" while the other is called "Yōko" is proof enough that they're meant to be different, or at least assumed to be different. The sprites are simply similar because both are supposed to represent this anonymous party who controls the twisted world within the game (AKA box people), but they aren't exactly the same.
Made a connection that could support the protagonist = Yoko alter theory: protagonist wears a flower in her hair, Yoko has a similarly-shaped flower on her hat. It's only a little thing, but I doubt it was completely insignificant.
Also worth noting that the flower in Yoko's hat is probably a white lily, given the petal shape and that Yoko mentions in a random conversation that she likes white lilies. Funnily enough, to my somewhat-limited knowledge, white lilies represent purity or innocence… but they're also associated with funerals and thus death, which probably fits Yoko better.
Just more random little things. It's hard to tell how much can be intended with little details like this, but it's always fun to examine them and see if they can be made to fit in any way.
Something I noticed is that the facility tends to get the most corrupted and warped whenever you separate from "Tsukiko". There's some parts with her that are pretty screwed up too but the majority of it happens when you're separated. I wonder how much significance is in that.
Also, how much of what happens in the box world(?) was really planned by Yoko? She claims to have engineered everything IIRC but there are moments when she seems as freaked and confused as the protagonist (potentially) is, or even moreso, especially with those letters from Shuichiro. Or maybe it's just more lies. But how good of a liar is Yoko, really? At times it's hard to tell.
>>5042>Something I noticed is that the facility tends to get the most corrupted and warped whenever you separate from "Tsukiko"
"Tsukiko" tends to show up one way or another with something clearly wrong going on after those sections. Either you find her box form or she's somehow messed up.
>how much of what happens in the box world(?) was really planned by Youko
It's hard to tell when this is Fake News™: The Game. The "Tsukiko" in the box world seems to be a seperate entity from the real Youko (in the route where you play as her, trapped in a box world) in general stemming from behaviour, etc. She also seems to take over the real Youko when she's talking with Shuichiro. I will make a followup poster later, i need to replay the game.
Adding to this, it might also be worth noting that Yoko in the Japanese is spelled with the kanji for "sun child", contrasting Tsukiko's "moon child". Kidan had the moon as a recurring symbol in the game (aside from Tsukiko, there was the moon key an the haiku, and IIRC some general text on the moon and its light or shape), but Gidan doesn't really have anything for the sun IIRC beyond "Tsukiko" being described as "warm as the sun" when you first meet her in her cell. It's hard to tell how much weight it has, but the contrast is interesting, especially in conjunction to Yoko taking Tsukiko's name. The game really does seem to be implying some sort of connection between them, but it's hard to say what it is, since in the real world the two seem to have basically no substantial connection whatsoever. Or rather, is it supposed to be taken in reference to their relationship with Shuichiro? Is Tsukiko to be a second Kanako to him and Yoko? (Probably also worth noting that Yoko goes to try and kill Tsukiko before Shuichiro stops her in the first ending.)>>5041
I wonder if the flower in the protagonist's hair is also supposed to be a lily, then, or some other kind of flower. Red lilies apparently symbolize love (unsure of what type, but I'd guess romantic) or passion, but the closely-related orange lily symbolizes hatred. Neither of those really relate much to the protagonist, blank state that she is, and not much to Tsukiko either, but if she's an alter of Yoko, then they make more sense.
Forgot, yet another point (probably) in favor of the Protagonist = Yoko theory: at the end of the game, you put the fingers and blood extracted from lookalike corpses of the protagonist into a box, which in the second run of the game is labeled as Yoko's box.
A while ago, I was pondering the symbolism of the phones. That's an unusual device for a save point, at least in my experience–a phone is (traditionally) used to listen to someone else's voice, not record your own. So why a phone?
I wasn't able to answer why "phones are the save point", but I was able to think of something for symbolism of the red hint phones. Essentially, the red hint phones speak the truth, as they tell you hints to solve the puzzles. Now, if I have my information right, the box used in the ritual is said to speak the truth to the miko who performs the ritual. Thus, the red phones seem to be connected to the box in some way–in fact, if the facility is inside the box itself, then it could be the manifestation of the box's voice telling the truth by giving hints on how to progress–that is, to uncover the truth. (It may be worth noting that no red phones appear in Yoko's route.)
This may also help to support the "Protagonist is Yoko" theory, as (again, if my information is right) only the miko who performed the ritual could hear the voice of the box.
>>5059>(From just before the first chase sequence on the second runthrough.)
Uh, wasn't there something else you did? I don't remember the exact context, but this is related to your knowledge of what the game is about (hence why it happens on the second run). It literally means "You too will be trouble if that isn't given". If my memory doesn't fail, Yōko is bothered you seem aware of what's happening and she's basically saying "If you don't play along even you will be in trouble".
That aside, anyone interested in helping translating Milya? I'm just dicking around and learning how lol wrote this thing to translate it later (I haven't sent any mail yet because I don't even know when I will start seriously).
So I was wondering why Yoko needs to force the protagonist through this whole murder game thing instead of just killing her on the spot, if killing her is the whole point. Then I realized that it's probably because Yoko needs the protagonist to perform the box ritual – it's what opens the exit doors, and it's when the exit doors that Yoko goes in for the kill and shows her true colors as a result. Hard to figure out specifically why the box ritual is needed before the protagonist can be killed, though…
Interesting that the protagonist needs to get blood and fingers from corpses of herself to put in the box, though (Yoko's own box if Yoko's route is any indication). If she's an alter of Yoko, does that make the whole of Gidan some sort of internal attempt at suicide? Coat Yoko is trying to stop her so she can keep murdering (therefore validating her lie, which is apparently the murdering of the villagers according to the liar puzzle and the Yoko route ending), but Shuichiro thwarts it all in the end by killing Yoko in the real world anyway so the suicide succeeds. This actually makes a surprising amount, hm…
Also, more symbolic evidence for protagonist = Yoko: Coat Yoko has a white lily on her hat → chaser Yoko has a bloody lily in her hat → protagonist's hair flower is completely red and also shaped like Yoko's hat lily, therefore a completely-bloodied lily. Also also: protag apparently has a hole for a force, chaser Yoko has a holeface, "normal" Yoko develops a hole face on occasion (once in the second route after the liar puzzle, think it happens elsewhere too but I can't remember).
Now someone needs to help me figure out why Yoko killing you if you enter the storehouse door code without asking her first and failing to solve the fingers x boxes puzzle in time flat-out give you game overs instead of triggering another "press A to revive" sequence like with the chases and traps…
>>5072>This actually makes a surprising amount, hm…
I meant "surprising amount of sense". Ugh, I'm a terrible self-proofreader.
What's with the text file of corrupted Japanese that appears in the game's folder? The one labeled "髯ｽ蟄舌�隧ｱ繧剃ｿ｡縺倥ｋ縺ｪ".
That mojibake file is some sort of flag that appears when Yōko snaps in the room full of boxes and goes full-distorted.
I'm not entirely sure what's its purpose other than to appear in that scene, since it doesn't seem to affect anything, choice/ending wise. It was already distorted from inside the game script so I can't say what it was supposed to mean originally either, or if it's supposed to be "corrupted" by default (which is what I actually assume).
Honestly, the biggest question I have about this game is how the fuck did Yoko survive the box ritual? Supposedly it requires disembowelment and amputation of fingers and yet Yoko seems perfectly physical fine aside some apparent scarring she wears the gloves to hide. Was that ever explained or am I interpreting the information given about the ritual wrong?
Well, the way I interpreted it, the ritual basically consisted on cutting the tip of the fingers, not the whole thing, and using blood from the guts.
or maybe it was jus an appendicitis surgery
, who knows.
Found a bug, sort of. It requires a bit of explanation, because it's a bit roundabout.
I have a bunch of saves for quick access to different parts of the game without needing to do a whole playthrough. However, these were only done on the first runthrough of the game, which causes a bit of a bug, when I play the "second" runthrough (the one done with the PublicData and corrupted text file in the game folder) by loading one of these save files: whenever I walk into the room just before the break room, the one with the letter that causes Tsukiko to freak out, Tsukiko automatically teleports to the letter and shuts me off from progressing until I talk to her… even if I've loaded the save file after Tsukiko's left the party due to being supposedly killed in the infirmary. But that's only one half of it: apparently interacting with Tsukiko here turns the switch for idle conversation back on, so whenever I press A, Tsukiko will talk to me, even if she's not actually in the party with me. This causes further weirdness with the last chase and ending – whenever I press A to revive, a piece of Tsukiko's idle chatter plays. I've found the events still run fine despite that, so the bug doesn't break the game, but it's definitely a moodkiller.
Maybe there's more bugs caused by this conflict of runthrough-specific flags (or even just reactivating Tsukiko's idle chatter), but I haven't stumbled on any others so far; I haven't really investigated.
Someone will have to do the report for me, because I hardly know any Japanese, let alone how to communicate something as detailed as that bug to someone.
Interesting detail I found while replaying: after the third corrupted chase from the infirmary, these three doors at the very "bottom" of the facility don't open, yet they could be opened before the chase (obviously, since you have to be able to get the medicine). I wonder what's up with that, especially since every other door aside the few related to the box ritual's completion can be opened at that point of the game.
Another odd little detail I noticed is that, when entering the room with the math puzzle for the first time, a very very faint overlay of what seems to be Tsukiko's face appears just before you enter the room. I have no idea why this happens, since the room doesn't matter at all outside of getting the key for the warehouse (as far as I know, anyway)… It's like just for the creepy factor like the bloody footsteps, but this one strikes me as particularly odd since it's so hard to catch – it took me tens of playthroughs of the game before I even caught it once – and because the same overlay (if it really is Tsukiko's face) appears a few other times, like during the warehouse event and when the chaser catches you. It just seems suspicious.
…I guess I'm overanalyzing. I should find something else to do that isn't replaying this game over and over again…
>>5043>I will make a followup poster later, i need to replay the game.
Did you ever get around to that?
Does the leave/stay choice do anything other than change the box person's dialogue?
So. I stuck the contents of that gibberish Japanese file into Google Translate out of curiosity, and got this out of it:
"There are a couple of creatures in their cities.
The number of liters is equal to the number of liters.
Incomplete design of fuel injection system
The setting value is greater than the set value
The number of entries is less than or equal to the maximum number of entries
If there is more than one of them, the cumulative number is greater than the other."
With the title of the file translating to "Learning from the University of Tsukuba"
I put all this into Bing Translator and got complete gibberish back out, as one would except, so I have no idea how or where Google Translate even got something this coherent, let alone what it even refers to.
I wonder if it's possible to translate this by converting it into another language (not necessarily a language so much as code) and then back to Japanese, or maybe by stringing together and then deciphering the individual sounds of the characters (since there's some katakana and letters scattered in there, and the kanji all appear to be legitimate), or something.
>>5199>I put all this into Bing Translator and got complete gibberish back out, as one would except, so I have no idea how or where Google Translate even got something this coherent, let alone what it even refers to.
If there really is any hidden message on that, you'd have more luck picking the binary data and opening it with different character encodings until hitting something. Google Translator does that weird thing where incoherent data translates as something else that makes sense (I remember people writting あ and then gradually adding more あ's and the output was longer texts that made sense in english even though they were just the translation of "Aaaaaaaaaaaa" from japanese).
>or maybe by stringing together and then deciphering the individual sounds of the characters (since there's some katakana and letters scattered in there, and the kanji all appear to be legitimate), or something.
That mess of text you see is called mojibake, and it's just random binary data being opened through a special encoding. Your text editor just reads the data literally in the encoding set by default/the encoding of the file, and since it's just random data, it outputs random characters. You only see legitimate kanji because the binary code for that kanji just happens to be there and is interpreted as said kanji in the encoding with which you opened the file. If you changed the encoding to ascii you'd only see latin characters and everything else as boxes because your text editor wouldn't even know how to render them.
I'm trying to play this game on Linux using Wine, but I'm having problems. I've installed the RTP and can open the game and get it to run (albeit a little slowly, but from what I can tell lag is unfortunately normal for VX games run in Wine). However, when I try to do something like open a door, the game gives me an error message saying it can't find the right file (it seems to be the ones with Japanese symbols in the name) and shuts down on me.
(Yes, I am running this with the Japanese language command "LANG=ja_JP.UTF-8". I have also tried "LC_ALL=ja_JP.utf8" only to get the same issue.)
I would appreciate the help since I love this game and have no Windows machine to play RPG Maker games on.
Never mind, I found the problem; I hadn't properly installed the language packages for Japanese. (I thought I did, but apparently I missed a few steps.) Now the game works properly–better than other VX games I've tried, actually. Wonder why that is…